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Thread: FastPass+

  1. #51
    Senior Member Not That Josh's Avatar
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    I think I could be more optimistic about FP+ if there was not the assumption that Disney will be directing people to FP+ and helping them use it. One of the things that helps all of us is that not everyone knows what a FP is and many never use one. If, during booking or check-in, Disney directs people to use FP+, then a higher percentage will be using it than FP's now. Who can guess how that will affect things. There are too many variables to it for it to be predictable, which is probably why I have avoided reading much about it (except this thread and a couple of others).

  2. #52
    Senior Member Not That Josh's Avatar
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    I would think child swap could stay essentially the same.

    Can't answer the tour group question (from any country) because I don't know much about how they plan now.

  3. #53
    tests unsafe roller coasts in china blyday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not That Josh View Post
    I think I could be more optimistic about FP+ if there was not the assumption that Disney will be directing people to FP+ and helping them use it. One of the things that helps all of us is that not everyone knows what a FP is and many never use one. If, during booking or check-in, Disney directs people to use FP+, then a higher percentage will be using it than FP's now. Who can guess how that will affect things. There are too many variables to it for it to be predictable, which is probably why I have avoided reading much about it (except this thread and a couple of others).
    I strongly doubt that this is really going to do anything. The thing is that there are very destictive groups of people out there who do not currently use FPs and those people are not going to change just because Disney tells them about FP+.

    The first group are the "non-informed by choice". This group is the one that has all of the information right in front of them....practically begging them to learn about it but refuse to. For example....the 2 ladies I heard talking about the FP lane and that people had to pay extra to get it, etc while holding a park map in their hands with the FP information on how it works, etc right in their hands!!! The truth is that the information on how to use FP has always been readily available.....people just plan choose to ignore it because they don't want to be bothered with reading about it.

    The next group of people who are going to be turned off by FP+ and those are the "spontaneous" group. These people don't even make ADRs because they don't like the idea of having to decide in advance where they will eat. I can't tell you how may people posted on the Disney Facebook questions about FPs how they didn't like being told when they had to return to a spot in the park. What if they were over on the other side of the park when that window opened. If they won't make ADRs and don't like the restrictions of the current FP system.....then you can pretty well guess that they are not going to want to plan which park they are going to be in and pre-arrange FPs 60 days in advance!!!!

    Another group of people are the "I like to stand in line" group. (This one I really have never understood.) Again.....I read response after response after response about how standing in line is half of the fun of being at Disney and allows them to have more time to visit with each other, meet new people in line, etc. You can bet that they too will not want anything to do with FP+......after all....they like their lines!!!!!

    Sure....there might be a small number of people who will start using FP because of the whole new system.....but there might be a similar number of people who stop using it. So in the end.....I just don't see FP+ suddenly becoming inundated with new FP users.
    Brenda

  4. #54
    Senior Member Not That Josh's Avatar
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    You are the first person I have seen with that opinion. I hope you are right.

    Even if Disney tries to get people to do it at check-in, who knows what rides they might pick and how that will affect lines anyway?

    I sound like a broken record with this: those who are tuned in, like people on this site, should have at least some advantage no matter what system exists.

  5. #55
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    I hope when Josh takes us on his "count the smiles" tour he includes a sidetrip to see the "I like to stand in line" folks. :))

    My thoughts are that Disney has always dangled carrots to get people to go where Disney wants them. Look at dining reservations; ever punch in a random "breakfast" request at a TS restaurant? You are directed to the 8-9 timeframes. Even when 7:30 is available. Same with resorts. You'll never get the entire list, only what Disney wants to direct you to. You have to be specific. FP+ will be the same I think for those who don't really know their way around....*fingers crossed*

  6. #56
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    Interesting that the terms have been updated. I wonder how close Disney really is to making the system available to everyone to use. My thoughts are perhaps in the next few months, by July for sure. I hope that it is not one way (FP) or the other (FP+), if you can still get both that would be golden. If you have to choose then I 'm not sure I would like the limitations. As others have mentioned how great it would be to be able to crush say MK in the early AM and then move over to another park..say HS with TSMM, RnRC, and F! Fp+ lined up after being all freshly recharged from a nice afternoon break!! That would be a dream, and would definitely increase the value of getting the hopper upgrade.

  7. #57
    does anybody know how to change this? pfalcioni's Avatar
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    Sure....there might be a small number of people who will start using FP because of the whole new system.....but there might be a similar number of people who stop using it. So in the end.....I just don't see FP+ suddenly becoming inundated with new FP users.
    You are the first person I have seen with that opinion. I hope you are right.
    I think Brenda is right. How long has Fastpass been around? At least a decade. How much information does Disney put out there about the product? Lots, at least they used to. They had TV ads about "skipping the line", plenty of print ads showing families with FP in hand, walking past standby lines. The Year of a Million Dreams (which lasted much more than a year) included Dream Fastpasses which were advertised in all the media. Same with the What Will You Celebrate promotion with its Birthday Fastpass.

    Not only that, but if you're staying on-site, there's information on the TV when you turn it on, there's info in the folio you receive at check-in, and there's info on every park map.

    I don't know the number, but in spite of all this, I'll bet a good 20% of park visitors don't understand and have never used the current FP system.

    Now think about how many people you personally know who don't like computers or other electronic "gadgets". All of those people will be actively ignoring the new FP+ system. Even if they used the old system in the past, they will not want to deal with the electronic nature of the new system and will avoid it if possible. Those numbers will get added to the already large number of people who have managed to stay ignorant of the current system for over a decade.

    Add those numbers to the folks who don't want to make reservations months in advance and don't want to be told when to be someplace while they're on vacation, and I'll bet at least for the first year or two after FP+ is implemented, they won't have a very high percentage of park-goers using the system.

  8. #58
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    Sounds more like wishful thinking to me.

    For example, what are the odds that TWDC spent $1B on a new high-tech system without having some idea of how many people would be comfortable using a computer before they arrived, or a touch-screen kiosk that day? Remember, there will still be in-park kiosks, so you don't *have* to do things in advance. But some people will. In at least this sense, FP+ is strictly more attractive to people in general.

    Yes, there are whackadoos who like to stand in line, or post other silly things on Facebook strings, just like there are nutcases who post the dumbest things imaginable as online comments to newspaper articles. They aren't representative. People are stupid, but they aren't *that* stupid.
    Last edited by bnoble; 03-29-2013 at 06:44 PM. Reason: there their they're!

  9. #59
    Senior Member Not That Josh's Avatar
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    It would be nice if you two were right, but I keep hearing this described as FP for idiots or some variation on that.

    People seem to think that Disney is going to put significant effort into getting people to use FP+. I think people could end up using FP+ in the same way that they use EMH. Many don't really understand EMH but use it because Disney says to so it must be the right thing to do. I feel like Disney will really be pushing it on people, especially at first. As always, Disney will adjust once they see some results, but I feel like they will be more aggressively pushing FP+ than they ever have with FP.

  10. #60
    tests unsafe roller coasts in china blyday's Avatar
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    Where I agree that Disney will most definitely be pushing this, etc.......I still don't think that it is going to be the crazy impact that some of us are fearing. And let's face it.....how many of us have gone to WDW and ridden the same attraction 3-4 times because we knew how to maximize the FP system? Well....that isn't going to happen now because we will be limited....period. So....we get our 3 FP now....all for different attractions. That now opens up more FPs for those few people who are going to start using this new system who didn't use it before. So....I still say that we aren't going to see this huge upswing of FP usage. And quite honestly......I can see me using even less then the 3 FP per day and if we do.....it very well could be for something like F!. So....this again means more FPs for people to use.

    Here is the way that I see FP+ working for someone like me:
    We arrive at the park for RD and do our morning rides without FPs. Let's face it.....I know enough of how to tour that I really can make it without FPs for the first couple of hours at least. So....we might want one for the morning....but if we are hopping parks....then we'd want the FP for the evening. We take a break and then return to the park or hop to a different park. When we go back to a park, we typically are there for a more relaxed evening and for evening entertainment....so having 3 FPs to need to use might really be more then we want to deal with....so we might have 1 or 2 set up but that is all.....unless we are using one for our evening entertainment.

    Yes.....there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that our touring will be changed by the whole new FP+ system.....but I really don't see the changes being something where all of the FPs are going to be gone for a day over night or anything like that. I don't have some diluted, rose colored glasses view of all of this.....I just have accepted the fact that it will change things and move accordingly.

    And as far as the research thing....sure....there are people who will say a bunch of crazy things on line.....but I've heard it in person also. You'd be surprised at how many clients I get who really don't have any interest in doing any planning....period. They have even said to me "We know that there will be long lines but that is part of what going to Disney is all about....right?" And trust me....they believe this. I'm sure you know people who feel this same way. I'm sure that the main thing that FP+ is geared to change are to accommodate all of those who like to arrive later in the day and were very upset that FPs were gone for the major attractions or pushed too far out for them to use, etc. That really was the number one complaint that I saw on all of those FB surveys that Disney did last year. And FP+ really will tilt the wheel in their favor. Right now.....the early birds have the scale tilted WAY over in their favor. The limits on FP+ usage will inevitably balance out that scale as far as FPs are concerned. So.....those of us ubber planners lose out but the majority of people who like to arrive later are going to benefit.....this is the larger crowd of people so they will be happy which in turn....makes Disney happy. It really isn't about getting those people who won't and don't read about FP to suddenly start using them....it is about making it more available to the average visitor (the one that likes to sleep in and arrive in the park at 11 AM!!) At least....that has been my take on it.

    And I also know that as much as Disney advertises this, etc.....the bottom line is that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. Which is why there were still so many people who had no idea what a FP was or how to use it even though information is literally all over the place!!!!
    Brenda

  11. #61
    makes josh ride in the passenger seat Rhonda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bnoble View Post
    Good article and if that is what happens to the GAC, it sounds fair.
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  12. #62
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    I think the big headache is going to be MK. Seems like 3 fp isn't really enough. The other parks I probably only pull 3 fp in a day because I ropedrop and actually ride a lot of rides in standby because they have little to no wait that early in the morning. However I think breaking MK up into 2 days or more is the best way to go with that park. For example I did a 4:30pm- close day at MK and stayed in TL and Storybook Circus, ate dinner, watched Wishes and parade, never went to the other side of the park. That night I pulled a fp for Buzz, Dumbo and Barnstormer. On my next MK day I did ropedrop -3:00 parade- and pretty much covered the other side of the park starting with Fantasyland and making my way all the way through Adventureland. I pulled fps for PP, BTMRR, JC and I think that is it. I did a lot and rode a lot of things standby with no more than a 20 minute wait. Now that was when Splash was closed so if Splash would have been open I would have probably pulled a fp for that one as well.
    I am going to try to stay optimistic. Our next trip will not be until Spring Break or summer of 2014 so I know it will be in full force by then. Hopefully my plan of ropedrop and hitting a lot of things standby in the morning will still be a wise plan. I guess we will have to wait and see...

  13. #63
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    I still don't think that it is going to be the crazy impact that some of us are fearing. And let's face it.....how many of us have gone to WDW and ridden the same attraction 3-4 times because we knew how to maximize the FP system? Well....that isn't going to happen now because we will be limited....period. So....we get our 3 FP now....all for different attractions.
    I think this *is* the crazy impact some are fearing!

  14. #64
    tests unsafe roller coasts in china blyday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bnoble View Post
    I think this *is* the crazy impact some are fearing!
    Well....if that is the concern.....it's a pointless one. Let's face....we will be limited on the number of FPs we can have....period. It really doesn't matter if 30% of the people use FPs or 100%....we will only get to have the number of FP that Disney says we can....no way around that!!!
    Brenda

  15. #65
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    Oh, I know...it's just that the vast majority of the sturm und drang about this has exactly to do with the various limits, just as there was great wailing and gnashing of teeth about return time enforcement. That wasn't a big deal, and this won't be either.

  16. #66
    tests unsafe roller coasts in china blyday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AR81 View Post
    I think the big headache is going to be MK. Seems like 3 fp isn't really enough. The other parks I probably only pull 3 fp in a day because I ropedrop and actually ride a lot of rides in standby because they have little to no wait that early in the morning. However I think breaking MK up into 2 days or more is the best way to go with that park. For example I did a 4:30pm- close day at MK and stayed in TL and Storybook Circus, ate dinner, watched Wishes and parade, never went to the other side of the park. That night I pulled a fp for Buzz, Dumbo and Barnstormer. On my next MK day I did ropedrop -3:00 parade- and pretty much covered the other side of the park starting with Fantasyland and making my way all the way through Adventureland. I pulled fps for PP, BTMRR, JC and I think that is it. I did a lot and rode a lot of things standby with no more than a 20 minute wait. Now that was when Splash was closed so if Splash would have been open I would have probably pulled a fp for that one as well.
    I am going to try to stay optimistic. Our next trip will not be until Spring Break or summer of 2014 so I know it will be in full force by then. Hopefully my plan of ropedrop and hitting a lot of things standby in the morning will still be a wise plan. I guess we will have to wait and see...
    I actually think that MK is easier to do without a lot of FPs as long as you are there for RD. DH and I typically will do: PP, HM, BTMRR, Splash, POTC, HM and Phil all by 11 AM without a single FP pulled. Of course, if you need to do all of Fantasyland plus want all of the mountains....the could be harder to do. But still manageable. Luckily....we have Josh to go in and figure out the best plan of attack that will let us do them all. But you are probably right....MK will become even more of a 2 day park then it is now for most people.
    Brenda

  17. #67
    tests unsafe roller coasts in china blyday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bnoble View Post
    Oh, I know...it's just that the vast majority of the sturm und drang about this has exactly to do with the various limits, just as there was great wailing and gnashing of teeth about return time enforcement. That wasn't a big deal, and this won't be either.
    LOL....so we are on the same page.....because that was really my whole point with the fact that I don't think that advertising FP+ will not have any actual impact on us "uber users!!"
    Brenda

  18. #68
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    that was really my whole point with the fact that I don't think that advertising FP+ will not have any actual impact on us "uber users!!"
    It will, in a way.

    The DIS has a pretty good thread estimating the current capacity of the FP-enabled attractions. We also know the average attendance in each park. Assuming the FP/Standby rations don't change, and if everyone uses FP+, then there is room to give everyone three per day with some leftover in each of the parks. But, there is not room to give everyone four an any of the parks.

    But, if a non-trivial number of guests end up not using FP+ at all, then there *might* be room to bump up the limits for those who do use it.

  19. #69
    Senior Member Not That Josh's Avatar
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    Funny, I thought you two were disagreeing too.

    I don't really have a strong opinion on it except that were are in good shape because we pay attention and because we have Josh to tell us what to do.

  20. #70
    tests unsafe roller coasts in china blyday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not That Josh View Post
    Funny, I thought you two were disagreeing too.

    I don't really have a strong opinion on it except that were are in good shape because we pay attention and because we have Josh to tell us what to do.
    Brenda

  21. #71
    tests unsafe roller coasts in china blyday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bnoble View Post
    It will, in a way.

    The DIS has a pretty good thread estimating the current capacity of the FP-enabled attractions. We also know the average attendance in each park. Assuming the FP/Standby rations don't change, and if everyone uses FP+, then there is room to give everyone three per day with some leftover in each of the parks. But, there is not room to give everyone four an any of the parks.

    But, if a non-trivial number of guests end up not using FP+ at all, then there *might* be room to bump up the limits for those who do use it.
    That is a good point.....but at this point in time....it really won't effect us because we all can be pretty sure that at roll out....they will keep the number at 3. So...planning for just the three means that if at some point in time it changes to 4....we can just see that as a bonus!!!
    Brenda

  22. #72
    does anybody know how to change this? pfalcioni's Avatar
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    For example, what are the odds that TWDC spent $1B on a new high-tech system without having some idea of how many people would be comfortable using a computer before they arrived, or a touch-screen kiosk that day? Remember, there will still be in-park kiosks, so you don't *have* to do things in advance. But some people will. In at least this sense, FP+ is strictly more attractive to people in general.
    How well are the touch-screen order systems working at the CS restaurants that have them? I know they have them at BOG, and I think they are at one of the CS locations at the Contemporary. Anyway, it seems like for many folks it's a struggle, and they usually have a CM there to hold their hand through the order process.

    I can imagine FP+ having similar issues at the kiosks, and some people just deciding it's too much hassle. People must consider the current system somewhat of a hassle, otherwise there wouldn't be so many of them standing in those 90+ minute lines all the time.

  23. #73
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    Somehow, the vast majority of the time, people manage to check in at airport kiosks just fine without help.

  24. #74
    wishes he had a pink frolicing llama under his tagline George's Avatar
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    If I ever start to wonder too much about FP+ issues, I have to step back and remind myself I'm worrying about floating down a trough filled with water and looking at dolls mouthing words to some disembodied song coming from some hidden speaker.
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  25. #75
    the jeweled acrobats only perform amazing stunts for him DopeyRunr's Avatar
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    Mmmmmmmm... Trough... *drool*

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